Review of China Southern flight Guangzhou Kuala Lumpur in Premium Eco

Airline China Southern
Flight CZ3407
Class Premium Eco
Seat 32A
Aircraft Airbus A319
Flight time 02:35
Take-off 24 Jun 15, 13:35
Arrival at 24 Jun 15, 16:10
CZ 137 reviews
marathon
By GOLD 4160
Published on 8th December 2015
This was my flight out of Mainland China, after several weeks of mixed business and private travelling there. The main reason I wanted to share this is the unexpected sight I had during this flight.

This report begins with a taxi drive to CAN

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A small pictogram in this flurry of directions confirms that this is indeed also that of the airport.

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This sculpture is meant to announce the airport according to the caption below (廣州白雲國際機場 : Guangzhou – Baiyun International Airport, in traditional ideograms).

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Reaching CAN; the driver never stopped chatting with me on the way

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The outside of the terminal; the rain protections were probably no luxury the day before when it was pouring.

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A panoramic view of the terminal when entering

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It was difficult to give a long look at the FIDS…

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… because I had hardly been there more than 30 seconds when a staff like the one in the background rushed with her tablet to offer information. She did not really understand that I enjoy day-dreaming in front of all the destination of a richly endowed FIDS: those that I visited, those that I would like to visit, those that I never heard about, those which remind me of good or bad memories…

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End of dreams: my destination that day was Jílóngpō 吉隆坡, because you may know that Kuala Lumpur, much like Bangkok (Màngǔ 曼谷) and Phnom Penh (Jīnbiān 金边), are not called at all the same in Mandarin. Other city names are written the same in China as in their own countries, but not pronounced the same at all: the Chinese say they go Dōngjīng orDàbǎn, not Tōkyō or Ōsaka.

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The line at the check-in for the CZ flights went beyond the movable barriers.

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With such a long line, I tried the self-check in machines, but was careful to tell the Chinese lady just after me in the line that I might be back.

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She indeed saw me take my place in the waiting line rather quickly :

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Flashlights are banned in checked luggage, because in China, they all contain a lithium-ion rechargeable battery.

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The line kept moving forward

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Only ten minutes waiting time from there (an accurate prediction)

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The recommendations on the hand luggage in the line and at the counter. The 5kg weight limitation is quite theoretical: my hand luggage weight was never checked on a Chinese flight, and I have seen many which obviously were beyond that limit in Chinese airports.

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On the other hand, I had not anticipated the day before that I would need to show a copy of my onward flight ticket. This is actually needed for the Malaysian visa exemption, but they did not ask for it at the immigration in KUL. But since there was a reminder in the waiting line, I had ample time to start my laptop and display it on the screen to avoid wasting time 40 minutes later at the counter.

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No problem at check-in. I do not know what the R before my seat number meant.

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Going to the international departures, after a series of domestic flights.

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Direction Gate A109.

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Gates A01 – A06 are for bus boarding.

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Plane spotting will be disappointing. The windows did not provide a view on the areas with the most traffic. A China Southern A330

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Sichuan Airlines A321

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A foreigner : Aeroflot A330

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And a MD-90, which stubbornly refuses to consider itself as Chinese, despite the claims of China Southern’s flight magazine, since Uni Air is Taiwanese.

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No internet connection for me, because you need to have a Chinese SIM card in order to receive a code, because the police wants to know who surfs on which website. In some Chinese airports, there is an information desk which can help you about it, but there was none there.

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I wondered why this flight to Beijing was here in an international flights section.

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This quite commonplace fountain delivers cold, warm or scalding hot water

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… but the temperatures of the first two categories do not correspond to my usual definitions.

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A group wearing very showy orange and blue jackets left towards another boarding gate

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I did the same, because my gate had changed, and I would board by bus. When there is no rain, I find it a plus, because it multiplies plane spotting opportunities, in a country where there are no restrictions at all on the tarmacs.

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I found the blue-orange group (and other passengers) downstairs. I suspected that they might go to KUL too (since they had changed gate like I did), and hoped they would not be too noisy during the flight.

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Some had found seats next to gate A05, but that was no proof.

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The room for bus boarding was as usual not very fancy. A Chinese food restaurant – the sign was curiously using both simplified and traditional ideograms: in a consistent manner, it would have been written 中国餐厅 and 中國餐廳, respectively

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A room for non claustrophobic smokers.

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Toilets with a lot of spilled water on the floor

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The air was both hot and saturated with humidity, despite this ventilator under the sinks.

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Plane spotting was limited to this one plane

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Boarding was announced, and I found the group with orange-blue jackets there

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The Sky priority line was respected: nobody seemed to have the status / travel class to be there, so that a staff was completely and uselessly idle.

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Isn’t it kind of too late to tell what is forbidden in checked luggage ?

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Chinese rules seem to mandate that there be two BP checks, but this one only has a single detachable tab, so we receive an anonymous well worn card

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… which will be given at a second check at the bottom of the stairs at the aircraft. Lo behold the hapless passenger who misplaces his card on the way – I do not know how the situation would be handled.

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The short bus ride gave a peek at the 4000th NextGen 737

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A CZ A321 CZ, but not that of my flight

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It will be this one

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The orange and blue cattle disembarks, with some outsiders like me

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Some boarded right away, while other were taking pictures of the aircraft

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Or pictures of passengers in front of the aircraft

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The lighting become increasingly dramatic, possibly the sign of yet another storm. I was not the only one to take photographic advantage of it.

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Did I forget to mention that no ground crew ever stopped me from taking pictures on a Chinese tarmac?

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And that Chinese passengers LOVE taking pictures of themselves or of companions in front of any easily identifiable backdrop?

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The terminal was not very identifiable (there was no giant 广州 in red letters), and therefore no Chinese passenger bothered to take a picture of themselves in front of it : an anonymous building has no value in their perspective.

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Arrival of an A330 against an increasingly dark sky

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She is obviously coming from SIN

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That is where the boarding card is given back

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I thought that only China Eastern had this welcome mat

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My picture of the J cabin is completely blurred, but this is one of the seats

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The numbering of the rows in economy starts at 31 in all CZ aircraft

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This was my seat, which had a travel plaid

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Did you notice the plug for the headphones? Yes indeed, this technology predates the birth of a number of Flight Reporters: the sound is piped through flexible tubes from a loudspeaker in the seat to the ears of the passenger.

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The headrest bore the China Southern and Skyteam logos, but I do no know what the W stands for.

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On the other side, there was an ad for moutai 茅台, a strong and expensive alcohol which is an essential ingredient of any party thrown in for bribing Chinese officials.

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Guangzhou is the hub of China’s trade with Africa, and is the Chinese city where I have seen be far the largest number of Africans each time I went there. It is no coincidence that there was a black passenger, possibly originating from Eastern Africa.

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I like the pattern of the carpet

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The seat pitch measured my way

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I had the pleasant surprise to have a Y+ seat, even though I had a Y ticket, in accordance with my company’s travel rules, and even though I did not have any Elite Skyteam status. That translated into a seat pitch which was a dozen centimeters larger than in economy.

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The safety information leaflet, both sides

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The safety demonstration’s design was the same as that on single aisle aircraft, with real actors off a stylized background.

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It was no surprise that I saw mostly CZ aircraft on the way to the runway, since CAN is the historic hub of CZ. There is an outsider there, already seen from the terminal.

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Another outsider, from Cambodia (Cambodia Angkor Air A321)

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Shenzhen Airlines738

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Can you imagine a major Chinese airport without a terminal in construction? This is bad news, because CAN used to be one of the few major Chinese airports with a single terminal, which made connections easy. It will be a thing of the past.

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Reaching the runway threshold

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Take-off a quarter of an hour ahead of schedule, and a view on the present terminal

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Note an Iran Air A340, just in front of the tip of the wing

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The sky was mostly cloudy during the climb

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But I had nevertheless some interesting views, like this expressway knot

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And especially this confluent, seen from several angles

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The same, after contrast enhancing

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In the center, there is a building which does not have a center : the Guangdong Plastics Stock Exchange

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Converging but nearly parallel expressways

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Yet another expressway knot

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These are no rice fields: the white dots here and there betray the aerators of fresh water fish farms: the Chinese fish farms alone are so many that fish farming is predominantly in fresh water in the world, whereas it is predominantly in salt water, once you exclude China.

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This was the end of the Chinese landscape and a first pass for lunch with the drinks – also see here the very limited recline of the seat which is identical to that in Y, apart from the seat pitch.

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Coffee is always with milk on CZ flights.

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The tray comes afterwards

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Most Y catering in Mainland China offer the choice between chicken rice and beef noodles, and I always choose the former. This one was the last in a long series in that trip

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The butter was a purely French product: there was not a single word in a language other than French in the labelling.

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The plasticware was quite ordinary. The catering and especially the hot dish was up to Chinese domestic flights standards, apart from the presence of a banana. In this respect, I was still in China.

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The entire wing

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And the sharklet with the name 中国南方航空 which I do not need to translate for you.

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Most of the route was above the South China Sea. It would have been a pity not to look through the window though, because there was a special feature in the seascape about an hour after take-off.

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This island is completely different from the resort islands in the Maldives, and you need special permission to get there.

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The ship in the bottom left corner of that picture did not look like a cruise or cargo ship.

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What you see here is the 2,400 m runway and the artificial harbor of Woody Island in the Paracels archipelago. Woody Island, called Yongxing Dao 永兴岛 by the Chinese and Phu Lam Island by the Vietnamese, is a key element in the Chinese strategy of military conquest of the South China Sea. China tries to capture all the fishing and oil resources and control the sea routes at the expense of all other countries bordering that sea, and dominate them militarily to break a potential geographic blockade.

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There is here a naval base which keeps growing thanks to incredible volumes of landfill. The purity of the air in that air discloses lots of details, despite the limited quality of my compact camera.
The stadium where the military practice sport is easily recognizable, but specialists would probably identify other structures.

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China has been for a long time an exclusively military power: the American shield might not have been enough to protect Taiwan in the 50’s if China had had a decent navy and air force at that time. China has long expanded on land only.

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Economic and technological growth allows China to develop a navy and an air force which are still limited in size and potential compared to the scale of the country, but nevertheless very disquieting in view of its aggressiveness. Trying to conquer militarily territories at the expense of one’s neighbors is quite has-been by European standards ; Europe since 1945 has grown out of that, but the present Chinese leaders have not yet learnt from the lessons of the past like some visionary statesmen did in the West.

This course of action generates an improbable alliance between the countries along the shores of the South China Sea who see with no displeasure the US propose to back them up, at the furor of China which tells them to please mind their own business.

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Like some other militarily sensitive areas around the world, some of the Paracels are blurred on Google Earth, but Woody Island is not, maybe because it is well known. But you only need to board a flight on the CAN-KUL route, choose a window on the left and pay attention. These other atolls are uninhabited, but better not try to explore them.

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These are not empty words. On 26 October, the USS Lassen penetrated the 12 nm limit of the territorial waters of Mischief Reef in the Spratley Islands – another disputed archipelago in the South China Sea – that China is actively transforming into yet another naval base by filling its lagoon.

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(US Navy picture)

China lambasted at an infringement of its sovereignty and the US curtly answered that they were performing routine operations in accordance with international law; matters did not go any further because the Chinese knew their forces were no match, but things are a lot rougher when they find Vietnamese fishing boats.

What complicates matters is that the countries alongside the South China Sea have a more restrictive interpretation of the 200 nm Exclusive Economic Zone and 12 nm territorial waters off a coast than most countries in the world, refusing the right of innocent passage of foreign military ships in the latter. A sea where half a dozen ownership claims overlap and where bases are being built in the immediate vicinity of each other is a powder keg.

If you want to invest into a paradisaic desert island, better head towards the Pacific Ocean. That is where the bloodiest war at sea of the 20th century took place, but that of the 21st century might well take place in the South China Sea, where all key players are now setting their forces on the chessboard.

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After this naval geopolitical bonus, let’s go back to the inside of the plane and its fittings. My neighbor had gone to the toilets and I took this opportunity to do the same. A view from the rear:

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The Y cabin was not entirely full; see the last row on the right as a proof

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The seats on the left of that last row do not recline

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Was the last row the only one where the seat pitch was less than on CA by around 5 cm? This was the only place where I could measure, since there was no passenger there.

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Child care is as usual a female business
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The “Fasten seatbelts” sign and therefore in the toilets “Return to your seats” is lit by default in Chinese aircraft. What counts is the PA warning of turbulences – the prerecorded warning also announces that the service is interrupted, which is not necessarily the case.

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Proof that it was not interrupted

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A peek at the rear galley while waiting for the toilet, without any surprise.

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The Chinese Customs logo is made up of a key and a caduceus, i.e. the staff with two snakes of Hermes, the god of traders and thieves alike. (The medical caduceus is the rod of Asclepius, which has a single snake and no wings)

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Since I enjoy the unexpected luxury of flying Y+, I too was allowed to go through this curtain to reach my seat (not this FA !)

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Chinese airlines Fas are not fussy about picture taking during take-off and landing phases; on the other hand, they are adamant about the Chinese regulation prohibiting the use of a cell phone on board, even in flight mode. My neighbor who played a simple game on his smartphone was asked to please stop, no matter the flight mode, and this was not a first for me.

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Another distribution of drinks – fruit juice for me

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The cloud cover was limited above the Malaysian peninsula

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Don’t rely on me for identifying the places we flew above, though.

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A terminus railway station

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The forests in Malaysia are much neatly ordered to be natural. These are large scale palm tree plantations.

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We crossed the peninsula south of KUL and then flew north alongside the West coast

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KUL’ LCC terminal is nearly operated like another independent airport, called KLIA2 to tell it from KLIA (Kuala Lumpur International Airport). The parallel runways gave me the opportunity for an air-to-air nearly to the mutual touchdown.

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This was a 737 belonging to Malindo, the Indonesian subsidiary of Indonesia’s Lion Air.

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Don’t rely on me for telling you if this is a 738 or a 739: both exist in Malindo’s fleet and there is not all that much difference in fuselage length

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The Malindo 737 was going to land shortly before we did

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Palm tree plantations, again and again

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Touchdown and thrust reversers deployment

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KUL’s control tower

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These two vintage 747-200F (TF-ARM and TF-ARN, built in 1980!) have been stored on KUL's tarmac since 2012. They, and a third similar 747, were last listed as owned an Icelandic leasing company, with one of them operated by struggling MH.
Just before I posted this FR, KUL's managing company advertised (see here) that whoever owns them had 14 days to pay the accumulated parking fees and collect them, or else they would be disposed of.

This is a unique opportunity to offer a really memorable Christmas gift to your loved one ! (Mrs Marathon declined)

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Thanks to Jetset for providing me the story behind the picture :)

An MH A380

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And an MH 777

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Arrival at the terminal alongside a Garuda 738, ten minutes ahead of schedule.

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Last view of the aircraft at the jetbridge

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I like the interior design of the terminal

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The layout of KLIA’s terminal (i.e. the legacy terminal in KUL) is a cross which is linked to the airside part through a people mover only. There is a small tropical forest in the center of that cross that I did not have time to explore.

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Arrival at the platform for transfers to the immigration and exit

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Last chance for some plane spotting from the people mover from the place where it is above ground: an MH 737.

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The place where I saw the most planes was at the FIDS at the far end of the people mover. Arguably small ones, though.

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The waiting time at immigration was reasonably short and the paperwork extremely fast, and I was among the first passengers at luggage delivery .

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I like the stopwatch providing the time until the luggage delivery starts

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Right on predicted time, the first orange and blue passengers receive their luggage, or vice-versa

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Passenger delivery accelerates, and luggage delivery too.

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I only needed a fast car ride to my hotel in the city center: the traffic was light at that time of the day. These are the iconic KL on the left and Petronas towers on the right.

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This is the end of this FR on a flight to Kuala Lumpur, and the beginning of a tourist bonus which may remind you of the two most boring activities during the summer vacations: visits of museums supposed to enlarge your culture and homework supposed to stop you from forgetting what you had been taught at school.

Rather than describing the collections of a museum, I propose here a virtual exhibit which could have been held at Kuala Lumpur’s Museum of Islamic Arts, with some loans from KL’s National Museum and from Singapore’s Museum of Asian Civilizations.

What is the theme? Magical squares on Chinese ceramics made for the Persian world.

My thin excuse for choosing it is that this flight originated from China's commercial hub, and that most items were seen in museums at the destination.

A magic square is a square grid where each cell contains a different number so that the total of the numbers on each line, each column and each of the two diagonals is identical, like this one, the only 3x3 magic square, apart from rotations, symmetries and additions of a constant.

2 7 6
9 5 1
4 3 8

Magic squares have been known as early as in the 7th century in the Arab and Muslim world whose mathematician were the best in the world at the beginning of the golden age of Islam. The Islamic world later gave them protective and mystical virtues.

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When China started exporting ceramics towards this market, it adapted to the demand of these customers by decorating the bottom of dishes and bowls with magic squares, always 4x4.

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The square is sometimes left empty, like this dish in the background.

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The calligraphy was usually added in the destination country, but this was not always the case. The periphery of the two ceramics below are nothing but gibberish which only vaguely looks like Arabic letters and does not have any meaning.

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With regards to the magic square, it is hardly better: the ceramic maker did not bother to fill the square, and the one above meets neither the number unicity rule, nor the criterion of the sum on the diagonal: alternating numbers 11 and 15 would be rated Fail to the lazy student who would propose this in his homework.

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The notules in the museums in Singapore and Malaysia do not mention it, but nearly all the magic squares of these ceramics are wrong, like this one displayed in Kuala Lumpur’s National Museum.

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I spare you the effort of checking, because I already did it for you: of all the ceramics displayed in these three museums, this one in the Museum of Islamic Arts is the only one which has a true magic square, whose totals are all equal to 195.

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It is not “normal” though, i.e. the numbers are not in a continuous sequence: there are numbers 41 through 57, except 53.

48 51 55 41
54 42 47 52
43 57 49 46
50 45 44 56

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Note that this correct magic square is filled with numbers using hybrid digits: the 5 is Persian, but the 4 is Oriental Arabic.

0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 Western Arabic
٩ ٨ ٧ ٦ ٥ ٤ ٣ ٢ ١ ٠ Oriental Arabic
٣ ٢ ١ ٠ ۴ ۵ ۶ ٧٩ ٨ Persian

Another curiosity not mentioned in these museums is that these 19th century ceramics appeared to be made for the Shia market, i.e. Iran and its closest neighbors. The reason is that when the writing is correct, the periphery is decorated with a mixture of Koranic quotes and Shia eulogies to Allah and Ali. The sides of the magic squares actually bear the traditional Shia motto:

لا فتى إلا علي لا سيف إلا ذو الفقار
No brave, other than Ali ; no sword, other than Zulfikar

Thanks for reading this all the way to the end; comments are welcome!
See more

Verdict

China Southern

7.8/10
Cabin9.0
Cabin crew8.0
Entertainment/wifi6.0
Meal/catering8.0

Guangzhou - CAN

8.5/10
Efficiency10.0
Access10.0
Services6.0
Cleanliness8.0

Kuala Lumpur - KUL

9.5/10
Efficiency10.0
Access10.0
Services8.0
Cleanliness10.0

Conclusion

This medium haul flight was not very different from a Chinese domestic flights lasting two hours or more, aprt from the fact that it was on time and that my checked luggage was delivered at the destination (it was not always the case in the preceding weeks).
Comfort was disappointing in CAN: I waiting longer that expected at check-in (and this time, I had confirmation that the self check-in machines did not recognize me), no wifi, toilets in borderline condition and nearly no services in that section of the terminal.
Efficiency was optimum in KUL: there is a fast rail link, but a driver was waiting for me this time and the traffic was light.
In both airports, immigration controls were fast, friendly and efficient.

Related

15 Comments

If you liked this review or if you have any questions, don’t hesitate to post a comment below !
  • Comment 151964 by
    KévinDC TEAM SILVER 6668 Comments
    Thank you Marathon for this very detail account as always! I've been curious to see what Premium Economy means on some Chinese carriers.
    Am I correct to assume that a normally a W ticket would give you priority check-in and boarding (i.e. Sky Priority)? I'm guessing that since you were not aware that you had been upgraded until you were onboard that this is why you had to endure long lines?
    Il y a ceux qui montent dans l’avion, et ceux qui photographient l’avion - There is some French left in the report; I see we have similar translation techniques :-)

    It is interesting that such a short narrowbody as the A319 can be divided into 3 classes of service, but then again, the seats in premium Economy seem to be exactly the same as Economy except with more legroom--the U.S. carrier Eco+ concept. Oh wow, I haven't seen those tube headphones since I was a little kid in the 90s! Pretty crazy to see them in 2015! Maybe it is in celebration of the Back to the Future movies with 2015 being the famous date in the future :-)

    The butter was a purely French product: there was not a single word in a language other than French in the labelling. - sarcasm? LOL
    The meal looks like a typical Chinese domestic Y meal (which is equivalent to Domestic First class meal in the U.S. LOL). So aside from the increased seat pitch, there really isn't much difference in service for W class.

    Nice aerial shots on departure and arrival. Chinese architecture is really very ambitious. Thanks for sharing!
    • Comment 329749 by
      marathon GOLD AUTHOR 10116 Comments
      Indeed, I did not expect to travel in W, so I did not even envisage trying the priority check-in. But then, once reached, the terminal had little view and even less services, so it did not matter much.
      Priority boarding would have been a disadvantage, because the Elite bus leaves so that you wait as little as possible on the tarmac, and I wanted to spend there as much plane spotting time as I could. :)
      The increased seat pitch was nice, but my legs do not need much of it.
      A reader of my French version (oops! sorry for the leftover sentence ;) identified THE difference in the catering from Economy : there was a BANANA ! That alone should justify the difference in price, in CZ's marketing eyes, at least. :)

      I did not expect to see this type of headphones in the 21st century. Actually, I did not expect them to be still marketed when the aircraft was built in 2006 !

      Thanks for your comment !
    • Comment 329757 by
      KévinDC TEAM SILVER 6668 Comments
      I wanted to spend there as much plane spotting time as I could - I don't blame you! That's the best part (and pretty much only good part) of boarding by bus.

      That's one Premium Banana! Hah, what a joke. At least on AF, where Intra-European Premium Economy is the same seats as Economy, you get a premium meal and champagne--but then again, economy doesn't get meals in Europe, so I guess it's not comparable. Good thing you got upgraded to W for free because I struggle to see the value of this product. I am a fan of true Premium Economy cabins on long-hauls, however.
    • Comment 329751 by
      marathon GOLD AUTHOR 10116 Comments
      Many thanks for letting me know; I do appreciate that.
      I posted close to 100 reports in English; the Search page will help you find them. Enjoy !
  • Comment 151998 by
    Jetset 52 Comments
    Wow this is pretty interesting. I learned a lot about China.

    First of all I didn't ever though about WiFi at Chinese airports. In general I think the Chinese censorship is strange.
    The temperature settings of the water dispenser are quite interesting.
    I like the look of the China Southern livery. Have you ever noticed that a lot of Asian carriers have this kind of banderole around the aircrafts nose?
    I have never seen a welcome carpet on a plane. Obviously this is nothing special in China.
    The headphones technique is really retro. So you can't even plug your own headphones in?
    The stock exchange building probably is the most interesting building in the whole report.
    I have never noticed that the last rows seats also have tables. Kind of useless.
    It was really exciting when I saw that two 747s in KUL, because I just heard about them just hours before. (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-12-08/did-you-forget-your-planes-airport-takes-out-ad-to-locate-owner) You really should add this information to the report.
    • Comment 329791 by
      marathon GOLD AUTHOR 10116 Comments
      “Wow this is pretty interesting. I learned a lot about China.”
      My pleasure :)

      “First of all I didn't ever though about WiFi at Chinese airports. In general I think the Chinese censorship is strange.”
      In China, you need to provide your identity to access the internet, and then you have to deal with the pervasive Chinese internet censorship(a.k.a. the Great FireWall). You have better get yourself a good VPN before setting foot in the country, or else you will be frustrated by the amazing number of mundane services and websites which are inaccessible there without one.

      “The temperature settings of the water dispenser are quite interesting.”
      Water dispensers of this type are common place in Chinese airports, but this one had a problem.

      “I like the look of the China Southern livery. Have you ever noticed that a lot of Asian carriers have this kind of banderole around the aircrafts nose?”
      It had not struck me, but yes, a number of them have that.

      “I have never seen a welcome carpet on a plane. Obviously this is nothing special in China.”
      I have never seen that outside China, either.

      “The headphones technique is really retro. So you can't even plug your own headphones in?”
      Well, unless you have kept one from your childhood, and old enough to remember the time when they were all like that in planes… : )

      “The stock exchange building probably is the most interesting building in the whole report.”
      In China, old coins (round with a square hole) bring luck and fortune. They actually make fake ones nowadays, for lucky charm purposes only. The majority of today’s Chinese banks have a logo which is based on that shape. This hole is also very good for fengshui. So it makes sense that they built a stock exchange building with that shape, although not very easy from the engineering point of view.

      “I have never noticed that the last rows seats also have tables. Kind of useless.”
      My guess is that it costs more to have a special design for the last row. (I had not noticed either!)

      “It was really exciting when I saw that two 747s in KUL, because I just heard about them just hours before.”
      Wow, that is fascinating. Yes of course, I updated my report accordingly!

      Many thanks for your comment!
  • Comment 152020 by
    eminere™ 271 Comments
    Another fascinating and educational report, as usual. I enjoyed the commentary about the naval territorial disputes in particular.

    Why does CZ start row numbers in Y at 31?

    The W on your seat's antimacassar corresponds to the class printed on your boarding pass.
    • Comment 329789 by
      marathon GOLD AUTHOR 10116 Comments
      I guess that this numbering scheme allow ground staff to know that a BP with row 30 and less is Elite, beyond 31 is economy, whatever the aircraft type. They managed to keep it with their A380s : 2 rows in F, J from row 2 to 29 in the upper deck, with 9 rows of Economy behind. They could not have an all-J upper deck like some airlines do.

      Thanks for the clue about that W (I am not used to that naming convention), for teaching me the word antimacassar :) and for your comment !
  • Comment 152058 by
    NGO85 SILVER 1963 Comments
    Thank you for another fantastic report Marathon, always an educational experience :)

    “I enjoy day-dreaming in front of all the destinations of a richly endowed FIDS”
    - To her, you were just another lost ??. There are many bad memories for Numero_2 when it comes to flight in China ;)

    the Chinese say they go D'ngj'ng or Dàb'n, not T'ky? or ?saka
    - Interesting because the Japanese pronounce ?? as “Shanhai” and ?? as “Pekin”, which is phonetically the same.

    I have only ever seen carry-on luggage weight checked once during my time in Asia. It was on CA, but ironically on the IAH-PEK flight so it wasn’t even CA agents. They must have just been following the CA guidelines to a T.

    “I do not know what the R before my seat number meant”
    - Right (R) versus Left (L) as you approach your seat? Did you see any boarding passes with a different letter?

    “Toilets with a lot of spilled water on the floor”
    - You hope that is water ;)

    “I thought that only China Eastern had this welcome mat”
    - Me too^^ Maybe they stole it from an MU plane…

    I’m surprised that an A319 has a three-cabin configuration. Seems like a waste of space to have a Y+ section that offers a pitch the same as J. Eminere beat me to the W explanation.

    Was the fruit juice served warm? There seemed to be a lot of condensation on the cup. The meal itself looks very average for Chinese standards.

    “Child care is as usual a female business”
    - Not on UA's B787s.

    The Y cabin was not entirely full; see the last row on the right as a proof
    - I call this EconomyFirst

    Fascinating discussion on Woody Island, as a Japanese resident I am all too aware of the impending threat of China's aggression in the south Pacific. On one hand the Japanese are really upset with the Okinawan US presence, but at the same time, they really can't afford to kick them out.

    Until next time^^
    • Comment 329838 by
      marathon GOLD AUTHOR 10116 Comments
      - Thank you for another fantastic report Marathon, always an educational experience :)
      - My pleasure :)

      - I enjoy day-dreaming in front of all the destinations of a richly endowed FIDS.
      - To her, you were just another lost ??. There are many bad memories for Numero_2 when it comes to flight in China ;)
      - Or rather a lost ???: Chinese does not have this mildly derogatory abbreviation like in Japanese ^^

      - the Chinese say they go D'ngj'ng or Dàb'n, not T'ky? or ?saka
      - Interesting because the Japanese pronounce ?? as “Shanhai” and ?? as “Pekin”, which is phonetically the same.
      - Japanese has both on-yomi and katakana, i.e. linguistic tools to pronounce and transcribe Chinese and foreign words (often with considerable distortions). Chinese does not have the equivalent, and uses very few phonetically imported foreign words, such as ??, pronounced [bài-bài]

      - I have only ever seen carry-on luggage weight checked once during my time in Asia. It was on CA, but ironically on the IAH-PEK flight so it wasn’t even CA agents. They must have just been following the CA guidelines to a T.
      - Or local LCC-like American guidelines ?^^

      - I do not know what the R before my seat number meant”
      - Right (R) versus Left (L) as you approach your seat? Did you see any boarding passes with a different letter?
      - I checked and found that my other flight out of CAN was also on CZ in W, and I had Seat 34A, also with the same letter R. All I can say is that nothing changed in four years in that matter.

      - Toilets with a lot of spilled water on the floor
      - You hope that is water ;)
      - I struggled and failed to find your words to convey the meaning ;)

      - I thought that only China Eastern had this welcome mat
      - Me too^^ Maybe they stole it from an MU plane…
      - Or a Skyteam convergence ?

      - I’m surprised that an A319 has a three-cabin configuration. Seems like a waste of space to have a Y+ section that offers a pitch the same as J. Eminere beat me to the W explanation.
      - On the other hand, the space used for that additional seat pitch would not be enough to squeeze an extra row in Y

      - Was the fruit juice served warm? There seemed to be a lot of condensation on the cup. The meal itself looks very average for Chinese standards.
      - I would have noted if the fruit juice had been warm (I had that at times in China). Apart from the banana, it was a typical economy meal.

      - Child care is as usual a female business
      - Not on UA's B787s.
      - Eliminating that discrimination against fathers will be a long 21st century uphill battle ;)

      - The Y cabin was not entirely full; see the last row on the right as a proof
      - I call this EconomyFirst
      - lol

      - Fascinating discussion on Woody Island, as a Japanese resident I am all too aware of the impending threat of China's aggression in the south Pacific. On one hand the Japanese are really upset with the Okinawan US presence, but at the same time, they really can't afford to kick them out.
      - What incensed a Japanese friend of mine (a foreign relations academic) is that the US charges Japan a fortune per military stationed on these bases in Japan. Japan does not get a free ride when it comes to military protection.

      - Until next time^^
      - ??????^^
  • Comment 152073 by
    757Fan 632 Comments
    Good report, and nice to read about China Southern. I wonder why they start Economy Class at row 31? This seems like a funny number to begin the rows.

    Thanks for sharing!

  • Comment 152088 by
    jetsetpanda 2283 Comments
    Thank you Marathon for sharing this interesting and fascinating FR. You always bring an unique perspective that makes your reports more compelling to read.

    I was recently in mainland China visiting some ancestral homes and the distance from the town where I was to HKG (where I entered from) was almost the same as CAN airport. CZ has a nonstop from CAN-SFO and I wonder if taking that flight would be more convenient than going via HKG should I plan to visit this area in the future.

    Flying Y inside China at least provides you with a meal which is more generous than flying domestic U.S.
    • Comment 329856 by
      marathon GOLD AUTHOR 10116 Comments
      My pleasure :)

      Like HKG, CAN is linked to the city by a subway line. Whether this makes landing in CAN more convenient very much depends on whether the convenience of the logistics to get to that place – the distance alone is not the only factor.

      Not only you have a meal on domestic Chinese flights, but you also have a 20 kg checked luggage allowance and they are not picky about the limit. You do not have the issue of all passengers maximizing their hand luggage to avoid paying extra, and not having enough space for them in the overhead bins.

      Thanks for your laudative comment !

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